lintamande | don't touch me

Confirmation reaches them in the spring that Elwing of Sirion has the Silmaril.

It takes as long as the spring only because they weren't looking. They can stretch the oath that far, they can be disinterested in knowing - but now they know, and so there it is. Elwing of Sirion is twenty-three. Half-man, so fully grown. Sirion is a city of refugees. Elves and Men and, since there are Men, children. Elwing herself has infant children.

They debate whether to send messengers. Debating is allowed, even protracted debating. The Oath, these days, is loud in their minds, and louder when they're pushing it like this, but they drag out the debate for a few months. Messengers will probably be shot on sight. The last time Elwing of Sirion received news of the House of Fëanor it would have been the news that her brothers, twins, aged seven, had not survived the sack of Menegroth.

They send messengers anyway. The messengers are shot on sight. They have good armor, Fëanorian armor, and return home injured but not lethally. Maglor's songs no longer stitch them together. War makes you worse at healing. Maglor's songs are more powerful than ever - he can knock back a wave of approaching enemies, he can make a blade's next touch deadly, he can make them faster and more impervious to danger, but he can no longer do healing.

Maedhros, when he thinks about this, thinks that perhaps there needs to be part of you that is not broken for healing spells to draw on. Or perhaps the Enemy is amused to strip that away first. Perhaps the Enemy finds it suited to the theme as the Oath tugs and yanks and twists them into violence against the lands they once defended and the peoples they once sheltered.

They send messengers to Sirion again. The messengers deliver a plea for the Silmaril, an offer of anything at all in exchange. The messengers do not return at all.

The Enemy is many many hundreds of miles from here but at night Maedhros can hear him in his head. Is it so implausible that I really let you go? the Enemy likes saying. You serve me better free than you ever would have willingly.

The Oath allows them to work slowly. They begin planning the sack of the refugee camp even more slowly than the Oath allows, so slowly that its currents are constantly tugging at them. Any slower and the currents would erode all the things they care about which are not the Oath, and it would be a disaster to go to Sirion once they've been stripped of their capacity to care about anything that is not the Silmaril. So they do not hold out forever. But they work as slowly as they can.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

From:

imeanforever

And in the other ninety percent he just fails to complete his redemption arc and maybe sets more people on fire?

From:

lintamande

In most of them he is unable to do enough good to overcome the harm he did, because you and your allies have already fixed everything. In few of them does he do additional harm.

From:

imeanforever

What proportion is few?

From:

lintamande

One in five?

Edited Date: 2016-05-27 07:26 am (UTC)

From:

imeanforever

Also, does the definition of harm you're using closely resemble mine?

From:

lintamande

I have been trying to use your understanding of all of the concepts you think with, as closely as I can. In one world Sauron develops a polio vaccine. This is not harm. He gives it to everyone. This is not harm. He uses the political leverage from that to persuade them to stop being mortals and find a way to live forever. This is not harm. They decide to do this by starting a war that kills millions. That is harm.

From:

imeanforever

What is a polio vaccine?

From:

lintamande

Are you going to keep the mass-murdering engineer family around? I recommend that you do. You complement each other. A polio vaccine is a thing that can be given to mortals to stop them from one particular way mortals suffer and die.

From:

imeanforever

...Sauron's not the only person who can invent that, is he?

From:

lintamande

He is not. Now that your acquaintances have talked with him I expect they will invent it as soon as the need rises to their attention.

From:

imeanforever

I would normally describe myself as being easily moved to mercy but in this particular case I don't feel very moved. I suppose I could ask Maedhros.

From:

lintamande

He is not easily moved to mercy.

From:

imeanforever

There are probably non-mercy reasons to be willing to see Sauron metaphorically turned into a frog. Maybe I should ask his boyfriend if I should ask him, in case it would be upsetting to even entertain the question.

From:

lintamande

Maybe you should do that.

From:

imeanforever

Promise goes looking for Maedhros's boyfriend.

From:

lintamande

Fëanor happens to have just walked outside to do the same thing. Maedhros and Fingon are sitting on the ground, several feet of space between them, staring at Angband.

"Findekáno," Fëanor says. "Thauron thinks that my son is in love with you."

"I, like Sauron, have only secondhand information on that."

Maedhros does not say anything.

"I am inclined to be very angry but if Thauron thinks I should be that is sufficient reason not to be. Can you instead explain to me what he sees in you?"

"Do you know how many times I've been tempted to ask you the same question?" Findekáno says.

Maedhros buries his head in his hands.

From:

imeanforever

Awwwwwwkward. Promise's question can wait, Sauron's not going anywhere.

...Actually, she could just go talk to Sauron.

"What are the first three sentences you have to say," she asks Sauron, "on the subject of whether you should get, quote, 'a redemption arc'?"

From:

lintamande

"Eru cares far too much about narratives at the expense of people," he says, "and scripted my role. If he is scripting another for me, I cannot promise not to twist it. If he'll stop making stories with me I will stop hurting people in them."

From:

imeanforever

"You know, I have some sympathy for the sentiment but under the circumstances that is not even slightly tempting me to argue to anyone that you don't belong in a black hole."

From:

lintamande

He doesn't answer. He can't answer.

From:

imeanforever

"Next three sentences on the subject?"

From:

lintamande

"I want to end fate. I don't know what you want or in what capacity I could help you with it. Our oaths are more comprehensive than orders and safer to use with hostiles in many ways, though I am not sure if it'd work properly if you ordered me to swear one."

From:

imeanforever

"I have no idea," she sighs, "and less idea of oath architecture than I do of fairy orders. Do you want to end fate in general or do you mean something more specific?"

From:

lintamande

"My objection was always specifically to the fates designed for this world, but it looks like they're probably already off course. Eru has other projects and I'd want the same thing there."